Overview
Here is a report on a project that I did a while ago that I'd started to write up but never finished up or posted: getting 1.10a +2 skills Bul Kathos Wedding Band rings. It is feasible and I found it pretty gratifying.
The goal is to find the elusive +2 all skills Bul Kathos rings. It's easy to see why these rings are desirable: it's the only way to get +2 skills from a ring slot. Normally, SoJs are quite desirable for builds that really need +skills, as those are often caster builds who benefit from the +mana more than they would from the life leech on an ordinary +1 skill BK ring. But for the additional skill point, casters will generally happily give up the useful mana mods on an SoJ. +2 skills BK are particularly desirable for builds that use OSkills in a melee setting, as there the +skills affect the OSkill and the life leech may be an added bonus.
The only version these exist in is the beta version 1.10a, which has synergies (unlike 1.09 and earlier) and the harder monsters in hell that we've all grown used to in 1.10a and later.
Concerns:
A few things to keep in mind:
ATMA doesn't work on the beta 1.10a, and neither does GoMule. So that meant that muling was a pain. Muling off meant for me self-MPing with two computers both running 1.10a, which was tedious and meant losing the map seed. So to keep muling to a minimum, I left an awful lot of things on the ground and pretty much just picked up rings and amulets. The downside was that I probably left some decent things there, but the upside was that the runs were very quick as I wouldn't bother picking stuff up, let alone IDing it, in general. To my mind, as someone who has done a lot of 1.11/1.12 MFing, the list of items that might reasonably drop in 1.10a from Andarial that I don't already have a zillion of in 1.11/1.12 is quite short, and is mainly just the +2 skills BKWB.
Where to find a BKWB
There a good discussion some years ago about trying to get SoJs efficiently. There was a nice writeup on the Strategy Compendium (I can only find it on the Wayback Machine at this link ) summarizing that. The analysis there was that NM Andy is a great choice for single-mindedly focusing on SoJs, as Andy not only has a decent chance to drop jewelry, but also there is the Andy quest drop bug which means that you can drop some MF in exchange for speed because of essentially what amounts to "free MF" from the quest drop bug.
Much of that analysis applies to BK rings. Of course, NM Andy is out since she can't drop a BKWB, but the arguments lead to Hell Andy as an excellent choice for a BKWB. Again, the quest drop bug is a big plus and her jewelry drop chance is relatively good. Running Hell Meph is a better choice if you are interested in other items that may drop, but its to my mind a slower way of getting BKWBs in 1.10a.
Running Hell Andy
So basically the idea is to get a character in 1.10a who can run Hell Andy quickly carrying decent but not over-the-top MF. Sorcs win here because of teleport, of course, but what build?
Blizzard is ordinarily a good choice for Andy runs, but in 1.10a cold mastery is weakened enough to make that a sub-optimal choice to my mind. I went with a straight fireball sorc with a decent ES. It's a pain not being able to kill some of the monsters in her chamber but the plan is just teleport straight there and then kill her quickly. Usually it was quick and easy- sometimes a nasty boss would be nearby which complicated things and slowed down a run.
My method was as follows:
1) Rush and level a character in a version earlier than 1.10a
Starting a character from scratch in 1.10a who can effectively run Hell Andy with decent MF would take a while. So it's quicker to gather gear and level in a patch previous to 1.10a and then bring the character forward one she is ready to go.
I used 1.07 since I have a stable of characters there and it was easier to do but 1.09 would probably be easier for many. Even though 1.07 doesn't have synergies, I selected her skills knowing that she would later be in 1.10a.
2) Bring her forward to 1.10a and then kill Andy over and over again until those lovely rings drop.
I wasn't sure if the "quest drop bug" applied in earlier versions, or for that matter whether or not it applied in 1.10a. So I played it safe by only rushing her to A1 Hell in 1.07. That was something of a pain, as that meant she could not do Hell Cows in 1.07 which is a great place for levelling there. (You can't enter the cow portal in pre-1.10 unless you already killed Ball in that difficulty, and the A5 Bloody Foothills experience runs that we so common in 1.09 are similarly out of reach for a character who has only gotten to A1 Hell.) I fitted her out with resonable MF gear- not top-notch but reasonable and things I have many 1.07 copies of. I did actually stop briefly in 1.09 with her as I had a Gull there for switch and the Gulls in 1.07 have a lot less MF than 1.09+. And at that point I didn't know if the quest drop bug would work in 1.10a.
Then I brought her forward to 1.10a and had her kill Andy in 1.10a on her own, since I was hoping that the quest drop bug worked there. Indeed, that method seemed to work, which was great, as it meant that maxing MF wasn't nearly as important and I could focus more on speed.
I focuesed on speed and survival as I was contemplating also doing this project in HC as well at some point, which I haven't done yet.
3) Find a good map for Hell Andy and run her over and over.
Of course a good Andarial map made things quicker. But every time her stash got full, I lost the map seed from TCP/IP muling. So I didn't pick up much except jewelry, jewels and some charms, so as not to fill up the stash too quickly, and also I didn't try to get the greatest map ever since I knew that in not too long I would have to give it up.
Results:
Here was the count of unique rings for my runs, which took place over about a month of intermittent play. I didn't keep track of the number of runs, I just picked up every unique ring for recording purposes. I kept track of all the rings I found for the first stretch and was fortunate to find 2 BK rings relatively quickly (well, if a few thousand runs is relatively quickly!):
57 unique rings from Hell Andy:
2 BKWB
2 Carrion Wind
11 Dwarf Star
13 Manald
17 Nagel
12 Raven Frost
In terms of relative rarity of items than can drop from Hell Andarial, those are:
Nagelring 15
Manald Heal 15
Stone of Jordan 1
Dwarf Star 10
Raven Frost 10
Bul Kathos' WB 1
Carrion Wind 3
That the chance that each of these ring drops (given that Andarial has selected to drop a unique ring) is its rarity/(total availble rarities). The sum of the availablity rarities is 55 in this case. So the chance that a given unique ring drop from Andarial is a BKWB is 1/55, same as an SoJ, whereas the chance of a Carrion Wind is 3/55 given that she has selected to drop a unique ring.
Note: these are probabilities that a unique ring that drops will be of various types. First she has to choose to drop a ring, and then choose that it will be a unique. So that probability depends of course on the players count and MF and can be worked out with ATMA for specifics. For example, the chance that Andarial quest drops from the "rin" treasure class is about 1 in 10 or so, and the chance she drops a unique ring with 200 MF works out to be something like 1 in 37, which means that the chance that she will drop a BKWB to be about 1 in 2000 or so.
So I was fortunate to get 2 BKWB over that stretch, but also not so fortunate to get any SoJs. Of course, there isn't anything special about SoJs in 1.10a and I already have bunches in 1.11/1.12, so of course I was much happier with BKWB rather than SoJs there!
I did more runs after that stretch but I stopped keeping track as carefully. I did find a third BKWB but I didn't keep as careful track of all the other rings that dropped in those later runs.
Readouts of the two BKWB I brought forward:
Spoiler
Code:
Bul-Kathos' Wedding Band
Ring
Required Level: 58
Fingerprint: 0x98c721e0
Item Level: 75
Version: Expansion 1.10+
+2 to All Skills
4% Life stolen per hit
+4 to Life (Based on Character Level)
+50 Maximum Stamina
Bul-Kathos' Wedding Band
Ring
Required Level: 58
Fingerprint: 0xccc5887e
Item Level: 75
Version: Expansion 1.10+
+2 to All Skills
5% Life stolen per hit
+4 to Life (Based on Character Level)
+50 Maximum Stamina
The third BKWB I don't have a readout from as it's still in 1.10a (no ATMA/GoMule) and I may use it there some before bringing it forward, or I may use it for a 1.10final Fireball paladin build I was thinking about or some other odd 1.10 builds.
I also did of course pick up unique amulets- but I was not as organized and I didn't keep or keep track of the lesser unique amulets. The yield there was:
1 Rising Sun
2 Seraph's
2 Highlords
1 Atma's
2 Cat's Eye
4 Crescent Moon
2 Saracen's
The relative rarities for Hell Andarial for amulets is:
Nokozon Relic 20
Eye of Etlich 5
Mahim-Oak Curio 5
Saracen's Chance 10
The Cat's Eye 5
Rising Sun 5
Crescent Moon 5
Atma's Scarab 5
Highlord's Wrath 5
I got some reasonable rare rings and amulets, some jewels and small charms as well. There was nothing really outstanding though besides the BKWBs, which were after all the main goal.
Final question:
Q: Is it a bad idea to obsessively run one target over and over again to find a specific item?
A: Yes. A much better way of finding items is just to load up on MF and kill things and see what drops, rather than looking for one specific item. But for this ring, it's pretty much the specific item you want from 1.10a.|||I starting writing this up some months ago but didn't finish it off enough to post it. It's not so much a guide as it is more of a summary and report of what I did. Any suggestions, comments or corrections would be much appreciated!|||Damn you are lucky with those rings
. I am doing 1.10a andy myself now, but still no luck (I have found 3x soj, 6x tal ammy, 3x herald of zakarum shields, bunch of shakos, Carrion Wind rings). It looks like i have found every unique/set items from andy for at least few times, but bkwb rings are pain in the ***.|||@FromLihuania: indeed, I was fortunate, but I did do a lot of runs! Deciding early on to focus just on small things (rings, amulets, jewels, small charms) sped runs up a fair amount for me. I really had to fight the temptation to pick up various other things (for my perfect grail, for my staffmod grail, for my ethereal grail, etc...) I'm sorry to hear you aren't having success yet- how many total unique rings have you found from her? If you've already found 3 SoJs from her, you probably have done a fair amount of running already!|||Fantastic! Great summary, and perfect timing for me!
I have a level 98 MeteOrb Sorc (pure Sasja guide, except I splurged a point in Enchant for the merc and have put the last couple points in Static to expand the radius... cows, you know) in 1.09 I was planning on taking to 1.10s for HF collections once she gets to 99, but she's done such a good job MFing in 1.09 while leveling (Mara's, BKWB, CK Horns, CK Hooves, BKSC, etc.), and since I did trade for a 1.10a Reaper's Toll for the merc, I think I'll try to get one of these.
For muling, is there not a multiple instance modified dll for 1.10a?
Obviously since my Sorc is levelling via Hell cows, she long ago finished the Hell Andariel quest. I'll check that question for you when I convert - what exactly should I be looking for to determine if she is quest-bugged or not?
Did you exploit any other 1.10a quirks, like the gem recipe? Was it you that made the 1.10a cheapo version of CtA? Is that worth a 1.09 Mal?|||@purplelocust I have neither counted the runs or ring amount from andy (I think it should be close to 80 or more). Also i have leveled my sorceress from 60 to 90 level doing hell mephisto on /p3. So i think that add little bit to
.I am interested in your sorceress equipment, skill placement and player setting you have been using.
@RobbyD I have made 1.10a cta and it is worth doing that (just look at this sexy beast http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/4584/l33t.jpg). It makes your runs faster and you dont have to worry about mana/life at all
. So bye bye potions and visits to akara.|||@RobbyD: Great job in 1.09, good luck in 1.10a!To check to see if the quest drop applies once you are in 1.10a, look for a magic item dropping that has both set and unique possibilities that she can drop. Or look at the durability of the magic items that drop (for items that have durability) and compare them to normal durability.
My understanding is that quest drops from Andarial are rare, set or unique. If you get a set or rare of an item type that either doesn't exist or she can't drop, it will be an increased-durability rare or magic item. Non-quest drops can have plain magic items (without the added durability) so that is a way of helping to figure out if the quest drop applies there and that would be good to know. I may have been overly cautious but I wanted to be sure that she had a chance at the quest drop bug.
I haven't made CtA in anything yet, so that must have been someone else. I often use instead a flesh-and-blood BO Barb, BeauBeau, who has a level 50 BO (and that's before I've had him wear the +2 skill rings!)
I haven't done anything else in 1.10a except the focused BK ring search. I don't know about the .dlls as I play mostly on Macs and generally use a second, third, etc. computer for my self-MPing rather than modifying any of the game files.|||Quote:
I am interested in your sorceress equipment, skill placement and player setting you have been using.
I haven't played her in a while, but when I am at that machine I can write up her build. Skill-wise I think it was a straight 20 in Fire Ball, Fire Bolt and Fire Mastery (I think I didn't go for Meteor at all- I'm sure she didn't have anything in Meteor when I moved her from 1.07 forward, but I did level during those runs. I don't remember using Meteor and I don't think I put any point into any fire skills except those three.) Then there was some combination of investment in Static, Teleport, Energy Shield and TK after the fire skills. I ran her at /players 1 or 3 I believe. I didn't think the additional time at higher player counts was worth the slight decrease in nodrop chance, at least with her.|||Not a single SoJ. You lucky bum.
GG guide/summary.|||@Robby: The modified .dll works fine for muling in 1.10a.
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